EURO+DRIVE PHASE 2 - The Official Thread - Page 33 - Alfa Romeo 4C Forums
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post #321 of 397 (permalink) Old 04-21-2017, 11:17 AM
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That tuner is the same as what we have.

No offense to Eurocompulsion, but I am just not a fan of what I call blind tuning or using canned tunes. Each car is different and it will take a lot of convincing for me to load something in which the seller has zero responsibility of paying for damages, when I have no visibility.

A Perfect example is in this thread with HumbertoR.
He knew something was not right, but had no way to look at it is and see what it was.
With the clone, the nice thing is, you can just swap the ECU, but that does not help in troubleshooting or let you know you need to immediately stop driving to avoid grenade-ing your engine.

I have HP Tuners and am used to being able to view, compare and flash tunes as well as log all of the parameters that I feel are needed to ensure the car is running correctly.

Even with the dimsport, it was not as detailed as HPT, but at least we could data log and then email that to the tuner so he could adjust the tune and send a new one back. The mini was also tuned by the tuner in person, so he tuned it, drove and data logged it, tweaked it, drove it, data logged it, tweaked it until he felt it was performing well and also safe.

I've never had the first tune end up being the permanent tune on any car I have owned.
I agree with you, I had a gtr with a cobb tune and took about 8 different tunes to get it perfect but the ECU that Eurocompulsion has isnt a very aggressively tuned ECU. Also all the OEM safety parameters are still in place to be a happy motorist. If your looking for peak performance then a tune on a dyno trough a qualified tuner would absolutely net you some more power but then again pushing north of 320 hp isn't a slouch for the weight of the car on the euro tune phase 2. Last but not least Chris and his team have sold 100s of these tunes with no ill effects as I know off and if you want any custom stuff done to your tune Chris is more then happy to oblige. As per the data logging would be great but I am in no way qualified to interpret those logs as good as Chris or any very good tuner can.

Plus Once you start modding and tuning your car all responsibility is on you. I have never heard of a tuner taking blame for blowing an engine on his or her tune. I've heard horror stories time and time again and always the same out come he said she said they all said. At least with the euro tune you have peace of mind that it is a proven tune that brings the car to power levels that are safe and under control.

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post #322 of 397 (permalink) Old 04-21-2017, 12:00 PM
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Good response.
Thanks for taking the time.

I wonder if some of the OBD-II smartphone apps could at least do that?
That would make me feel better.
It's a combination of my 4C being my new baby and me being a lil bit of a control freak


And man, I would love to be the test case but that's a little far.

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post #323 of 397 (permalink) Old 04-21-2017, 01:25 PM
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Any updates on the Stg3 tune?
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post #324 of 397 (permalink) Old 04-21-2017, 08:27 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by RYUK View Post
Good response.
Thanks for taking the time.

I wonder if some of the OBD-II smartphone apps could at least do that?
That would make me feel better.
It's a combination of my 4C being my new baby and me being a lil bit of a control freak


And man, I would love to be the test case but that's a little far.
As it was posted above the handheld is not applicable for this application. We may begin a push for its development in the future but we feel that a clone is better option on this platform especially with contending warranty concerns. The handheld you have is also locked to the original company who sold you the unit so it wouldn't do much good at this point regardless.
The AR 4C utilizes a wide-band sensor, performs long term/short learn cycles and also uses a multitude of sensor algorithms. Which is very good for us and allows us to fine tune calibrations without having to place each individual car on a traditional chassis dyno. We encourage anyone who would like to or find it interesting to data-log the car. This can be done through a multitude of programs available. Such as Auterra, ECUmultiscan and other programs. Hope that helps.

As far as Phase 3...its coming along and I apologize for the delay.
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post #325 of 397 (permalink) Old 04-21-2017, 10:03 PM
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Chris

Thanks for taking the time to answer. I do appreciate it.

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post #326 of 397 (permalink) Old 04-23-2017, 08:50 AM
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post #327 of 397 (permalink) Old 04-23-2017, 11:06 AM
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I actually re-read this whole thread.
I am exhausted.


One thing I did not see [and may have missed] but instead of a Dyno, are there any recorded comparisons of
60-100mph times?

As the top end seems to be the weak spot for the stock tune, I think that would really show the difference between a stock tuned 4C and a Stage 1 and Stage 2.
I don't think it would be too difficult to gather this data.

I do disagree on the statement that removing the Cat on modern turbo cars does not add any significant power.
Turbo's are spun by the Exhaust Gases. The Cat is the biggest restriction on Exhaust gases in a turbo car.
On the Kappa platform, we have extensive documentation and proof that replacing the stock cat with a High Flow Cat from Solo Performance adds 20+Hp on a 2.0 Liter engine with no other mods.
As a result, on the Kappa platform, the 2 best HP increasing Mods are a new HF Cat and tune.
That takes the car from 225WHP to 285-295WHP

I know the 4C is a different beast, so my statement is from my experience that non 4C platforms Do in fact benefit greatly from a less restrictive Cat

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post #328 of 397 (permalink) Old 04-23-2017, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by RYUK View Post
I actually re-read this whole thread.
I am exhausted.


One thing I did not see [and may have missed] but instead of a Dyno, are there any recorded comparisons of
60-100mph times?

As the top end seems to be the weak spot for the stock tune, I think that would really show the difference between a stock tuned 4C and a Stage 1 and Stage 2.
I don't think it would be too difficult to gather this data.

I do disagree on the statement that removing the Cat on modern turbo cars does not add any significant power.
Turbo's are spun by the Exhaust Gases. The Cat is the biggest restriction on Exhaust gases in a turbo car.
On the Kappa platform, we have extensive documentation and proof that replacing the stock cat with a High Flow Cat from Solo Performance adds 20+Hp on a 2.0 Liter engine with no other mods.
As a result, on the Kappa platform, the 2 best HP increasing Mods are a new HF Cat and tune.
That takes the car from 225WHP to 285-295WHP

I know the 4C is a different beast, so my statement is from my experience that non 4C platforms Do in fact benefit greatly from a less restrictive Cat
No recorded 60-100 times, though would welcome it. I tried to accomplish something similar but starting the quarter mile time database. Trap speed is usually a very good proxy for HP IMHO.

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post #329 of 397 (permalink) Old 04-23-2017, 11:28 AM
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It's interesting how the 3 fastest times are from Christian and Call me Al.
They have similar times when they are both on stock tires.

The change to ToyoR88s is what seems to make Call Me Al's second time faster.
That is how it should be.

I like 60-100 rolling times because it tends to eliminate traction as an issue.

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post #330 of 397 (permalink) Old 04-23-2017, 08:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RYUK View Post
I actually re-read this whole thread.
I am exhausted.


One thing I did not see [and may have missed] but instead of a Dyno, are there any recorded comparisons of
60-100mph times?

As the top end seems to be the weak spot for the stock tune, I think that would really show the difference between a stock tuned 4C and a Stage 1 and Stage 2.
I don't think it would be too difficult to gather this data.

I do disagree on the statement that removing the Cat on modern turbo cars does not add any significant power.
Turbo's are spun by the Exhaust Gases. The Cat is the biggest restriction on Exhaust gases in a turbo car.
On the Kappa platform, we have extensive documentation and proof that replacing the stock cat with a High Flow Cat from Solo Performance adds 20+Hp on a 2.0 Liter engine with no other mods.
As a result, on the Kappa platform, the 2 best HP increasing Mods are a new HF Cat and tune.
That takes the car from 225WHP to 285-295WHP

I know the 4C is a different beast, so my statement is from my experience that non 4C platforms Do in fact benefit greatly from a less restrictive Cat
60 to 100, 60 to 120 mph data would be great! But, and this is a big but, that kind of data isn't easy to get. Here in the USA, we can't legally or safely go those speeds. I think Nevada may have a few places where that's possible.

El Mirage dry lake isn't to far from me and the do land speed runs there. But, the rules state that any car capable of speeds approaching 150 mph need a parachute. AR claims our cars will do 160 out of the box. I'm not going to chute my daily driver.

Road course has it's possibilities, and it's downfalls. Turns get in the way as do driver skills. And few of have the cash necessary to have a private track. The other drivers will be in our way.

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